Episode 156 / Jennifer Mohammed / The North Face / Director, Go-To-Market Strategy
Podcast: Why Brands and Marketers Both Benefit From Remote Working
While remote working may no longer be a new thing, it’s still Jennifer Mohammed’s Shiny New Object for all it can offer to organisations and employees alike. The Director for Go-To-Market Strategy at The North Face has over 16 years’ experience in DTC and has been enjoying the new world of remote working as a way to balance home and work life, access a bigger talent pool, and truly globalise the way her brand speaks to consumers.
The reason that remote working is so close to Jennifer’s heart is also her commitment to a strict work/life balance. She believes strongly on freeing up her time from anything non-essential, allowing herself to spend it wisely on learning, developing, exercising and growing as a person. This is why Jen actually diarises every single moment of her day, blocking out time for preparing for meetings, exercising, and even taking breaks.
Ultimately, Jen says: “We have this culture of being busy, but saving time efficiently lets you utilise it in a different way.” This can be growing and learning new skills for your job, or it can be developing outside of work. Either way, prioritising and challenging how others may try to claim your time are important skills for staying healthy and grounded.
Remote working enabled this for many people from different socio-economic backgrounds or who simply would not have been able to maximise their days before. Rather than spending time and money commuting long hours, eating expensive takeaways and going out for lunch, Jen has found that she can allow herself to actually be more productive and compartmentalise her day differently. This will – in the long run – make her a happier, more efficient employee.
Beyond the positive work/life balance impacts of remote working, Jen also recognises its benefits for organisations who can now tap into a new and broader talent pool. By allowing home working, brands can include more diverse employees in their teams, people from different background and cultures and even from all corners of the world. The result? Speaking more globally and in a more relatable fashion to more consumers worldwide.
Listen to more of Jennifer’s thoughts on the benefits of remote working, as well as more top marketing tips, here.
Transcript
The following gives you a good idea of what was said, but it’s not 100% accurate.
Tom Ollerton 0:00
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Hello, and welcome to the Shiny New Object podcast. My name is Tom Ollerton. I'm the founder of Automated Creative. And this is a weekly podcast about the future of marketing. I have the pleasure and the privilege of interviewing some of our industry's leaders about their vision for what is coming next. And this week is no different. I'm on a call with Jennifer Mohammed, who is Director, Go-to-market strategy at The North Face. Jen, for anyone listening to this podcast who doesn't know who you are and what you do, could you just give them a quick overview of your career and what you do on a day to day?
Jennifer Mohammed 1:24
Thank you, Tom. And thanks for having me. Yeah, my name is Jen. My pronouns are she her. And I'm a sushi loving dog mum living in Switzerland. So that's my Tinder profile. But no, I mean, for me, what in terms of what I do for my job, and I've recently taken over the position of go to market director, which I'm sure not many people understand what that means. But it's a super cool role, working with brand leadership teams across all kinds of functions and all the commercial channels. So what I'm really focused on is supporting and tracking and optimizing all of our end to end seasonal business processes. And kind of really following from you know, seasonal concept kickoff through to all of our kind of go to market touchpoints either that you'd Salesforce marketing, and the consumer through to when the campaign and the product actually launches through in the market. So I've been in this position now for a couple of months. And before this, I was actually a director of Direct-to-consumer, working in planning, buying an allocation for all of the ended operator stores for retail, and tnf.com. But yeah, my career wise, I've been working with Direct-to-consumer for about 16 years, I think I'm aging myself now. But worked have had the fortunate pleasure of working across loads of different brands like Puma, Guess, and the Arcadia group based in the UK. So I've had some global, regional and market leadership positions across these different brands, and also had the pleasure of working in different countries as well. So that's kind of what I'm doing right now.
Tom Ollerton 3:04
So across these many roles, and across this love affair with DTC over all those years, which is great to hear, what new belief or behavior has made the biggest impact on your work life?
Jennifer Mohammed 3:18
Oh, gosh, I mean, that's a good question. I would say for me, you know, what's the new belief and behavior that I'm really focused on is you really got to work on setting your boundaries. And really looking at prioritization. I know, everyone kind of says that. But I think what kind of happened is, you know, when I was in my late 20s, I was diagnosed with cervical cancer. And just a side note, ladies, please make sure you get regular checks. But it really gives you a perspective. And, you know, I don't want to get too morbid about it, but we don't have an infinite amount of time. And so my view is, you know, at the end of my life, what would you give for like, an extra hour to spend with loved ones or doing something that brings you joy? So I'm really focused on not wasting my time. So for me, when I look at work, and when I look at the companies, I work for the structure and the meeting cadence, it's really about Okay, listen, you know, could this meeting have been an email? How do I clawback the hour? You know, can we please focus and not waste time and spending hours on productively? So improving efficiencies, really looking into what's really going to move the needle and what can kind of way or what doesn't need to happen, I think is super important. So you know, within that, it's also you know, work life balance as well. So to me, first point is, you know, really focusing on what matters Am I getting return on investment for my time and then how do I bring that into my work life to make sure that everything I do is with it with the lens of efficiency, and also not taking it too seriously? Right? Because you know, work For these brands, I sell jackets, I sell shoes, you know, I sell clothes. Like if something doesn't get done, what's the worst that can happen? I think people can take themselves really too seriously. And I think we just take a step back and realize kind of what's important. And don't sweat the small stuff. So that's kind of really how I've, I organized my time and kind of live my life.
Tom Ollerton 5:23
So that all makes sense. And not sweating the small stuff, and marking your boundaries, and having clear priorities always makes so much sense, and it's always so rejuvenating to hear that. But how would you deal with the reality of things being uncertain when you need to learn new things? So yeah, you can prioritize everything down to the absolute essentials, but there's always gonna be room for growth, either mentally or from experience level, learning new things that it's very hard to quantify how long they're gonna take. So one of the things I struggle with is when I take on a new thing, I'm like, oh, I'll just learn.dot.in a couple of hours. Well, actually, that could be like a day or once a year, or you know, a decade's worth of learning. So, my kind of struggle with essentialism is that you, if you only do the very, most important things that you know, you can sometimes ignore and miss out on very important things that you don't know that you don't know. So how do you make sure that you have your mindset, but yet, you're not denying yourself important opportunities that harder to quantify before you start climbing that mountain?
Jennifer Mohammed 6:36
That's, um, that's a really good question. And a really good point. I think for me, you know, what I was kind of trying to infer is, you know, with your day to day life, you know, freeing up that time, then enables that time for educational learning development, right. So it's like, if I'm making sure that I've managed efficiently, you know, my workload, my schedule, you know, my day to day core business tasks, right? It frees me up so many more hours to do what needs to be done. And I think it also comes down to like setting boundaries. So for me, I'm really clear on my weekends, on my own, you know, obviously, urgent things will come in, but hey, I want that time I want that time back. So, you know, I want to learn Italian, I want to learn how to ski. I like to do exercise. So carving out those little pockets to learn, develop and grow on a on a personal level, not only on a professional one, it's like if you can make and it's super difficult, right? Because we're in this kind of culture where being busy has kind of been, you know, almost like a birthright, you know, everybody thinks it's really, really credible, to be constantly flustered, constantly busy running out of meetings, and actually taking that time, and giving yourself the space to digest the meeting that you've just been in, you know, given the time to collaborate and work with other people and learn how their functions are working, or what skills that they have, and taking the time to also, you know, read, learn, research, listen to podcasts, it's like everything is around time, and how efficiently I can save it can then be utilized, how it can be utilized in a different way. So I'm not sure if I directly answered your question, but that's kind of where I'm coming from with that.
Tom Ollerton 8:20
And you have a bit of software that you rely on to help you with this ruthless commitment to efficiency.
Jennifer Mohammed 8:31
This is gonna sound super basic. It's not really a software, but it's my Outlook. So my Microsoft Outlook on the email, I literally carve out hours there. So every single task and this makes me sound super anal retentive. But it is, it's like I block out the time. So I have I'm super routine orientated right, so I'm up and out of the house at 6am every day, walk the dog, that's in the calendar. You know, it's like, it's timed, it's done. It's like, okay, we're gonna, you know, we have this beautiful like walk. It's like, I listen to my podcasts in the morning when I'm walking the dog. So I'm listening to your podcast Tom, or, you know, there's some really great financial ones I also listen to so I'm trying to learn a bit more about money and economy. So for me, it's like, okay, I carve out an hour and a half every morning for exercise and education. So the time I get back for breakfast is like what 8am 730 And I'm sitting down at my desk, then that's blocked out as well. So for me, it's really looking at my calendar to go okay, this is the time I want to assess this or this is my prep work for the meeting I need to attend and this is then the meeting I need to attend. So I think it's really important to have it all scheduled in and even have your lunch hour scheduled in right because you need to give yourself a break in the middle of the day. And so you need to not be accessible to everybody the whole time. And I think that's really something that the organizations and the companies that we're working for, especially with remote working, especially with a lot of virtual communication, is you are accessible all the time be that through your phone, your laptop, or even being in the office, it's like actually being able to set that time boundary and kind of say, Hey, this is what I've slotted for this. And this is my calendar as of today. And if you want to talk to me about something else, you know, feel free to slot it in, or you can approach me but I always make sure I sorted it out, I know what I want to be doing. And I know how I want to spend my time.
Tom Ollerton 10:33
So across your career, what would you say is your best marketing tip that you heard, received, or recently heard back in the day that you share most often with people who ask?
Jennifer Mohammed 10:46
And this is gonna sound so cliche? Like, everybody probably thinks this, but it's about being consumer first. And what I mean by that is, you know, I think it's really important for brands and organizations to speak to the consumers they actually have, and not just the ones they want to attract. You know, I think it's about the authentic positioning. And if you're, if you're not being authentic, and if you're not, if you're not reaching out to them, it's just a waste of time, money and effort for everyone involved. You know, I think, what I've what I've noticed in certain corporations, it's like, have you reviewed your best seller data? You know, go back review, why have people engaged with you? What is the review of your product or service? You know, have you got repeat customers? Are people coming back to you? Are they loyal to you? And if not, why not? And really focus on that, because for me, I feel that consumer loyalty is the single biggest unlock. And for that you need trust, right? You know, you need, I need to trust that what you're selling to me fulfills the need I have that that's a good return on investment for my money that I earned and does it perform as you promised it would. Because I think for brands to show up consistently, and have this returning base of good as consumers that trust them. It's the foundation for a stable, super stable and scalable business. So I think that's the thing for me, it's I think within that nuance of consumer first is look at your actual consumer, because when I look at some of the marketing campaigns out now it's like, Who are you trying to attract? And is that is that authentic to your brand?
Tom Ollerton 12:37
This episode of the Shiny New Object podcast is brought to you in partnership with MADfest. Whether it's live in London or streamed online to the global marketing community, you can always expect a distinctive and daring blend of fast paced content, startup innovation pitches, and unconventional entertainment from MADfest events, you'll find me causing trouble on stage recording live versions of this podcast and sharing a beer with the nicest and most influential people in marketing. Check it out at www.madfestlondon.com.
So we're gonna move on now to your shiny new object, which is remote working, which isn't that shiny new anymore. But what what does it let's say the future of remote working? What do you love about it? Or hate about it? And what do you think it's gonna be like, for the near future?
Jennifer Mohammed 13:33
I mean, I love it. I absolutely love remote working. And I think there's so much opportunity on this, if it's done right. You know, I think you need to have a balance. Yeah. And I think it obviously depends on the role and the organization. But if it's done, right, you know, we not only have access to a hugely diverse workforce, you know, if I consider, you know, if you were 100% remote, for example, you could be working with people internationally that don't need to relocate, that don't need to leave their families that wouldn't normally want to work for an organization like yours, because of the family commitments they've got, or, or the socio economic situation that they're in, you know, you all of a sudden get access to a huge diversity of people from different cultures, you know, different genders, however, you kind of want to put it different communities, and therefore, by having a more globally focused organization, that really enables you to speak to a huge wide range of people. So, I mean, that is one plus point, from a corporate perspective, I can get the best talent if we don't have to physically move everybody. And then the second point for me is, you know, it kind of links a bit with what I'm kind of saying with the behavior, you know, in terms of freeing up time, I like me being quite militant about it. I think there's there's very much an argument for the benefits of remote working for not only the employee, you know me, but also my employer, you know, I find that you can be way more productive. You know, I'm a lot less stressed. Because I don't have to worry about you have to worry about childcare, dog sitters, you know, if something's going on, it's like, I have all the facilities here that enable me to do my job, I don't need to commute in, I'm actually saving money as well. You know, for me, it's like those those lovely lunches that you'd have with everybody. It's like, well, you know, maybe it's a bowl of cereal at my desk, or maybe it's something a bit more extravagant, I've cooked at home, but enables me to really balance out my home life and my work life and get the get the most out of my productivity. You know, and I think as well, there's loads of super benefits, and we unquantified theoretically. But this has got to be doing good for the environment. You know, having a lot less commuters traveling around a lot less cars on the road must be huge benefits from pollution perspective, from an energy saving perspective, you know, people are not spending money on petrol travel. So I think in terms of the personal benefits of working from home, not only does it allow me to manage my home life a lot better. It also, yeah, for me, it's, it's, it's saving me a lot of money. And it's saving me a lot of time. So it's something that I'm super stoked about.
Tom Ollerton 16:35
So I was totally in your camp for most of lockdown. I was like, I can take 10 meetings in a row, I can do 10 creds meetings in a row. And that sometimes got near that number. And thought, well, I can only do like two or three of these in a day, like physically. And I thought, I just hope that when restrictions lift that we stay with this, you know, sales culture of just doing calls, because it's convenient for everyone, right? But I've found that in the last month or so when I've been out meeting clients, again, the richness of those experiences, and the depth of conversation has far surpassed any of the conversations that I've had over lockdown. So that's my experience, obviously, but how do you think that remote working can work alongside those deeper, more unstructured conversations?
Jennifer Mohammed 17:30
Interesting question. I think it's really about balance, right? Because I mean, right now I'm back in the office like two, three days a week. So I do completely agree, I think that personal interaction, and that kind of sense of community and that relationship building, you can't really do that over zoom. So I think there are definitely, you know, different calls for in person working right. And I think we, as an organization, we try to make sure that we carve out that time and those days. So we'll come in for a strategy day. And we'll spend the whole day together. And we'll really work through some some key business goals, right. Or, you know, if you want to have a specific one to one, you want to talk to somebody about their development, you know, I think it's really, really important to have that personal touch and that personal interaction, and you don't build relationships in the same way. But I think it's really the digital communication tools that really come onto the market, the past few, you know, zooms, teams, even utilizing WhatsApp in some degree, like all of these digital Titans, I suppose, have really made it very easy to connect with people very easy to drop someone a note or a text or a message. And so I think you have been a lot more accessible. I know I've been a lot more accessible, people maybe wouldn't come in the position that I'm in, they maybe wouldn't approach me in the office, but they're quite happy to send me a note because it's less is less scary for them. So that that can also build community and connection. But I think from an organizational perspective, you know, allowing work from home, and enabling the the office environment to have, you know, Zoom specific meeting rooms, so that people can hear people can dial in if they are working from home that day. I think it's really about just allowing the workforce and allowing the teams to manage themselves. And I think it's about giving people you know, the authority and the autonomy to really see how they want their departments to be run. And I think that's that's been something that's in my experience over the past couple of years, as I'm working really well, in the organization.
Tom Ollerton 19:49
Do you think there's an unspoken tension about the needs of us to do remote working and working more efficiently and the promise the shareholders of the giants that you talk about, right? So Slack, for example, Slackùs goal is to make more people use Slack more often, right? It's not to help Jen get a job done. It's not, it's not there to make sure that Tom finishes work in time to cuddle his daughter, right? That's not, that's not their goal. Their goal is to get more subs, more people using the platform and selling. Sorry, same with, with whether that's WhatsApp as you say that can be used well, whether it's team zoom, whatever it is, like their goal is to drive revenue for their business, the more sticky they are, the more money they make, but the more sticky they are, the worse they offer us. Or do you think I'm being alarmist?
Jennifer Mohammed 20:42
Bit alarmist? I mean, you know, I think there's always at the end of the day, it's very corporate life, we all lead, and we're all in this kind of economic code, right? So someone's making money somewhere. I think, you know, these tools, these these digital Titans, they have enabled us to work. And I think it's super challenging, right? Because, yes, they need us to keep to keep using their tools need us to not go back to in person working in person learning so much, in order for them to be profitable. Right. So if that is pushing innovation, if that's pushing technology, then I think, in essence, even though it might be for a greater evil, it's still it's still a really good resource that that we use, you know, I don't mean to quote, you know, I don't know if it's a Marvel movie, but with great power comes great responsibility. Right? You know, I think we need to we need to be utilizing these things in the right way. And for the benefit of the organizations we're in. You know, that being said, it's, yeah, it's quite easy. It's a good question. So I'm stuck.
Tom Ollerton 21:52
Well, I think we should leave it on the Spider Man, quote, I think; with great marketing comes great responsibility. I don't know, we can maybe I shouldn't have said that out loud. Anyway. If someone wants to get in touch with you about the topics that we've discussed today, how would you like them to do that?
Jennifer Mohammed 22:11
Oh, you guys can hit me up on LinkedIn. I think that's probably the best place. I'm, I'm not really social media savvy. So I don't have a Facebook, I do have an Instagram, but it's mostly for my food. So you're best off catching me on LinkedIn, if you have a professional request.
Tom Ollerton 22:27
And what makes a great LinkedIn message to you?
Jennifer Mohammed 22:32
Oh, you know, what, it's really, that's really challenging, and I don't think are necessarily good at it. Because I definitely reached out to people and just felt so embarrassed by what had been written. I think when it comes to me, it's probably easy to say what I don't like, you know, I don't like a lot of fluff. It's, it's, you know, when people kind of try blow smoke and be like, Oh, my God, you know, think you're amazing. I really want to talk to you about this. It's like, well, actually, no talk, tell me about you. You know, it's like, if you're reaching out to me, tell me about you tell me about what you're doing. You know, what do you want help with, you know, I think I don't need to, I'm kind of person where, you know, obviously, the compliments are lovely. But I would prefer really to to understand who you are as a person, and how I can support you how I can help you, you know, I do a lot of mentoring. And I really encourage everybody to, to really think about, you know, not trying to be selfish, but really think about themselves and, and really how they want to present themselves for for additional opportunity or for questions or whatever. So I would say yeah, lead with you. And, and yeah, then the next chat.
Tom Ollerton 23:50
Jen, thank you so much for your time.
Jennifer Mohammed 23:52
My pleasure. Thanks for having me.
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